Notice the right has bigger icons with a nice uniform regular layout. This 'honeycomb' crap shows the problem with MS's thinking.

If you lay 100 items out in a regular manner, then I see the ONE rule by which you laid them out. If you lay 100 things out in an *irregular* manner, then I see 100 things. I can navigate faster in the one rule case.

Look at the word 'internet explorer', move it to under the icon 'contacts' notice that the right column overlaps the middle column, depending on how long the text is. Presumably this is why the programmers honeycomb'd the icons, so that the icon in the middle is at the level of the text on the right, so the text could be longer without clashing with each other.

But it also means the screen is messy and uneven, and when I click in the middle column, sometimes it will be the long text of the left or right columns, poking into the middle column.

This is a programmers fix to the problem, not a designers fix. As a result the layout is uneven, the screen on the right shows a much more even layout with text chosen to better fit it.

I see the same problems with Android, and in both cases I think the design choices are more driven by programmers than designers.

Whilst there's no excuse for not including an accelerometer on a phone these days, it's worth noting that we used to manage to change orientation on our devices using a clever invention known as a "button". If HTC were determined to leave out the accelerometer, there's no reason they couldn't have still included the (utterly essential) landscape view for keyboard and web browsing.

You CAN arrange the icons on the Windows Start Menu. Just tap and hold any icon to bring up the option.

That touchflo dumps you into MS too often - have a Touch Pro2 (recently upgraded to 6.5 thanks to HTC's ROM release) and I have to say I barely use windows anymore, staying snugly wrapped in touchflo for virtually every task - don't have the media player problems either but then I did buy CorePlayer, you know, there's an app for that ;)

Also why is the lack of multi-touch zoom a problem when you've got single touch zoom thanks to the slide bar - you can hold the phone and zoom with one hand leaving the other free for whatever you maybe zooming into..

I've used WinMobile 6.5 and Manila 2.1 and Sense 2.5 (the HTC interfaces) on my Touch Diamond 2 for two months, and not used the stylus for anything except working with some custom applications (developed for non-touch versions of WinMobile).

Hell, you can CLEARLY see on the first page that there aren't 6 favourites in the contact screen, but 9 at least. You can see the three just above the Manila Tab strip; It scrolls when you slide your thumb / finger up the screen, and in fact holds 15 favourite contacts.

The Programs tab differs from the Start menu in that, again, it offers many Favourite applications at locations you choose instead of all applications in one long menu.

The WinMobile alarm interface you have a screen shot of I've not seen since ordering the phone; Manila comes with a custom app which controls the time, alarm sound, day of the week to set the alarm for, a description, all from a thumb-friendly interface.

The only let down I can think of is the screen; 320x240 is rubbish. Still, there are QVGA resolution cooked ROMs at [shamelessplug] forums.xda-developers.com [/shamelessplug] or there will be *very* soon...

In the times I've played with an iPhone or recently a Palm Pre, I've found pinch to zoom an utter PITA because it requires the use of your other hand, which just feels clunky.

Suggested price is £280 sim free... I will be surprised if its anywhere near that. I have found prices in excess of £450.

If anyone can let me have the details then I would be have to purshase atleast one for myself at that price!

Unless Microsoft revamp everything for Windows Mobile 7, this OS will continue to be a FAIL. Dropping down in to the old stylus interfaces is terrible. No wonder HTC's TouchFlo merely uses WinMob as an underlying OS rather than a platform as much as it can.

That also means that they can port TouchFlo to Android when it becomes viable to do so.

Nothing good here for Microsoft. AVOID.

I really wish you lot would stop whining about how bad WinMo is. Firstly its alot more powerful and most of the time stable than that horrible piece of junk known as the jesusphone... it sells because it works - the only pet peeve I have with it is the sync'ing - and thats probably a function of the horribleness that is Vista.

If you dont like WinMo - use Touchflo and look at XDA-developers for more information and ROMs...

If you dont like Touchflo - then mosey on down to PointUI's site and get a hold of that - the basic version is free too.

If you are going to review a phone or anything else - actually review it and use it properly - not do a BOFH and (i)phone it in from the nearest pub.

To be blunt the HTC designs are some of the best phones I have ever seen - I wont be touching Nokia after using them.

Oh and I am still regularly using a HTC 8500 running WinMo 6.1 & PointUI (steampunk theme) with microSDHC support - not bad for a phone from 2006...

Ive written large chunks of a couple of books on an HTC S710...

Granted the changes to 6.5.1 arent massive - but then neither were those on apple's last release of system 7.5.1 - then they gave us OS X ...

To be blunt - if you arent going to do a proper job of reviewing devices, then you might as well not bother doing it at all.

Opera does a great job of zooming in with one finger tapped twice (and then reformating the text to fit on screen). So, why the zoom slider at all?

And for that matter, I can browse the web one handed... so why do I want pinch zoom either?

I assume that you are, in fact, looking at a Touch PRO 2, you dingbat.

Re: Wow, a crippled Manila UI

I've got a Touch HD and have used various cooked ROMs also from [shamelessplug] forums.xda-developers.com [/shamelessplug] and that one seems laughably incomplete.

Contrary to some comments on here, the new Manilas don't "dump you into MS" that often really, it's been a looooong time since i've used my stylus. However this does seem a rather shoddy effort from a previously rapidly advancing HTC.

Jemma, I found your comments quite savage! :-) However I have to thank you for the tip on the PointUI software. I found WinMo very un finger friendly before installing PointUI. Now with PointUI installed I find WinMo much much easier to use. Thanks a million. Any tips on a better onscreen keyboard?

The age-old stylus type interface parts of WinMo (Calendar screen etc) are justifiably criticised. It shouldn't be that crap out of the box. That screen is the same as the one on my old HP ipaq circa 2002 - that's shite!

"Firstly its alot more powerful and most of the time stable than that horrible piece of junk known as the jesusphone... it sells because it works"

Surely you're mixing up the two systems no? It's taken MS a bloody long time to get WinMo to this state and it's still requiring a stylus?

The reason MS will be left behind in this market is because of their attitude that shows through here - take the turd and slightly polish it for the next version and hope your fanboys continue to laud it. There's a damn good reason the iphone (much as I hate it's tap-slide wielding drones) sells so well - the interface is a comparative dream.

@AC, 22:14, 21/10/09:

"Any tips on a better onscreen keyboard?"

Try FingerKeyboard 2.1 over at [shamelessplug] www.xda-developers.com [/shamelessplug]

@AC, 20:53, 21/10/09:

"I assume that you are, in fact, looking at a Touch PRO 2, you dingbat."

No... the link clearly shows a Touch2 at the stated price, dingbat.

@JeeBee

"That also means that they can port TouchFlo to Android when it becomes viable to do so."

TouchFlo, or Sense as it is also known, is already on HTC's Android devices. Notably the Hero and Tattoo.

@ Jerome 0

"...it's worth noting that we used to manage to change orientation on our devices using a clever invention known as a "button".

AFAIK, the screen orientation option hasn't been removed from WM6.5. In the Cooked 6.5 ROM I'm using on the Touch HD, Rotate Screen is selectable from the button mappings settings page. It's not available in the "Screen" settings page, but that can be changed with a registry tweak.

With that done, I'll still stick with Android for the Touch HD - which is well on the way to being day-to-day usaeable now!

that you can shoehorn WM6.5 onto other phones. Ive flashed my omnia to use 6.5 quite happily. No stylus in sight and my alarm screen look NOTHING like that one, in fact I could use my THUMB to add an alarm. A large TICK box with big up/down arrows when you click the time (if you didnt want to use the keyboard popup)

you must have had some ancient review phone or something. The new IE is lightyears better than the old piece of junk - so much so that I installed opera but havent used it yet!

The only gripe is that you cant hack the registry to autotimeout data connections, mine seems quite happy to randomly keep data connections open for no reason (no push, manual sync etc).

Thanks for the advice on the fingerkeyboard. Works a treat. Cheers :-)

Er, whut? I was the AC (not sure why i clicked the box though)

i can only assume that you were attacked by the most abrupt case of tl;dr ever as my comment was aimed at Zish who seemed to think this phone was 450 quid - obviously the rebuttal from Reg featured a link to the phone at the suggested price, it wouldn't be a very good rebuttal otherwise.

This is what I believe the original complainant was looking at:

http://www.dabs.com/products/htc-touch-pro-2-wi-fi-gps-674D.html

I have used WinMo from version 5 and it never unrecoverably crashed on me - and I am a tech user, I use pretty much everything on any phone.

I have never ever heard of a winmo phone doing a passable impression of a 130mm HEAT round and attempting to take a tweens leg off... nor have I run into one that wont let me change a battery, wont let me put on what I want or have the phone how I like.... enter the (jesus)phone... I have not touched the thing even in a shop and I wouldnt have one in the house.... I am as likely to date a police officer as I am likely to date anyone owning an iphone - even if they look like doutzen kroes .... cop or iNerk - is a deal killer.

I have flashed the 8500 I own from 5 to 6 to 6.1 - installed a totally new UI on it and it still is as solid as a rock. Same for the S710.

The Diamond I have is running Touch UI over a 6.5.1 rom and having recently looked into the calendar on there its miles ahead of what even 6.5 managed. I have one gripe alone and thats that you have to use the stylus to get to the numberpad, but since thats only one gripe and something I dont often use I dont really care...

WinMo still has eminantly more software available for it than the jesus-why phone. Not to mention that you can find something that does pretty much anything you want for free ... yeah ... you know, the part where you paid £50 for a handset (BNIB) as against £900, and then got lots of nice new snuggly software for it for nothing... zero... you know, the figure thats the same as the chances of Claudia Black and Nick Griffin getting down and dirty...

I said it before and I will say it again. If you cant do a fair and decent analysis of a device and actually give us a decent idea of what it can and cant do - and give us information on how it will do things with want with a little tweaking (after all, this is a tech-savvy readership one would hope) then stick to americans doing interesting things with stick shift F150's (its amazing what will fit...) and waaaay to much moonshine..